Location: Jade

Discussion: BotryoidalsReported This is a featured thread

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dbsagates
dbsagates
40. RE: Botryoidals
Oct 2 2009, 8:23 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 2 2009, 8:23 PM EDT
Wow Bill serpentinite fluids, brown scum or lemons. I'm impressed with your knowledge on the elements what ever it be. DB PS when we were down seeing my mom in Yuma we brought back a couple sacks of them from here own trees and they are way better than from the stores around here and much cheaper. She freezes up cubes of them and that way have them when ever all year long. DB Do you find this valuable?    
rockcandyguy
rockcandyguy
41. RE: Botryoidals
Oct 2 2009, 8:25 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 2 2009, 8:25 PM EDT
"My dad made a crystal radio when he was a boy. He ran a wire to a tall tree as an antenna . Sure enough a passing thunderstorm shot a bolt to the wire. The radio was setting on the family piano. The lighting destroyed not only the radio but also piano.
Bill "
I'd guess your dad's radio used a galena crystal tho, not a quartz crystal. Quartz oscillators were not common until the 40's. The crystal set I built as a boy called for a 'cat's whisker' as the contact with the galena. The neighbor's cat avoided me after that ... could have saved a lot of trouble if she'd just told me that a cat's whisker meant a thin piece of wire.
Bob
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aubreyreynolds9@gmai
aubreyreynolds9@gmai
42. RE: Botryoidals
Oct 2 2009, 10:01 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 3 2009, 9:14 AM EDT
More and more the scientist are able to do what nature has done over the eons in laboratories and industrial operations in a fraction of the time, Flawless rubies, sapphires, quartz crystal, and even more beautiful diamonds are routinely being created.. It is a sad a to see a little bit of the wonder lost. I was trained as an scientist and an engineer but if I lose the wonder of the undiscovered I think life would be over. I remember in the seventh grade my science teacher obtained kits from Bell Labs. The kits contained silicon wafers and we made solar cells. We had a science club and meet ever Saturday to learn . You guys teach me and I hope I will never stop learning,
Bill
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retiredoldfogee
retiredoldfogee
43. RE: Botryoidals
Oct 3 2009, 2:41 AM EDT | Post edited: Oct 3 2009, 2:41 AM EDT
"I'd guess your dad's radio used a galena crystal tho, not a quartz crystal. Quartz oscillators were not common until the 40's. The crystal set I built as a boy called for a 'cat's whisker' as the contact with the galena. The neighbor's cat avoided me after that ... could have saved a lot of trouble if she'd just told me that a cat's whisker meant a thin piece of wire.
Bob"
LOL, when I was 5 or 6 my Grandma told me I can make paste for a paper kite with flour and water. I went outside to her flowers and a cup of water, and picket the petals and mushed them up in the water, after about 45 minutes I brought in the concoction and asked her how long until it turned to paste.

Aaron
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gamaliel114
gamaliel114
44. RE: Botryoidals
Oct 3 2009, 4:04 AM EDT | Post edited: Oct 3 2009, 4:15 AM EDT
I want to share this Youtube video with you all. It is about ten minutes long, but worth the journey. it is a telling of an old Chinese(?) tale....So are botryoidals the bubbles of carp or dragons?

THE JADE STONE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bK4GK8fT07E

~Zeke
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aubreyreynolds9@gmai
aubreyreynolds9@gmai
45. RE: Botryoidals
Oct 3 2009, 10:50 AM EDT | Post edited: Oct 3 2009, 11:08 AM EDT
I have been reading about the Pacific Northwest Jade since Zeke got me started on the subject of nephrite formation. Thanks Zeke, The Graywacke of the Northwest is a result of the plate tectonics that dominates the geology of the region. Graywacke formation is associated with landslides that occur underwater, which carry fragmented rock, sand, silt, and other debris away from the continental periphery and into the deep waters of the ocean. Indeed, this rock type is particularly linked to subduction zones, where the collision of the oceanic and continental lithospheres results in frequent sediment release. Since in such unstable locations minerals, rocks, and other particles do not have much time to sort themselves out before they accumulate, when graywacke is formed from the materials, they seem to be mixed haphazardly throughout the rock,. The graywacke is a hodgepodge of various minerals. From pictures posted on the web, I agree with Bob that the wacke is glassy with silica. A picture taken at Blewett Pass, WA State, USA (north out of Ellensburg, I-97) looks like a green quartzite. I am going to check the box of goodies Aaron sent me. Do you find this valuable?    
rockcandyguy
rockcandyguy
46. RE: Botryoidals
Oct 3 2009, 11:36 AM EDT | Post edited: Oct 3 2009, 11:36 AM EDT
" The Graywacke of the Northwest is a result of the plate tectonics that dominates the geology of the region. Graywacke formation is associated with landslides that occur underwater, which carry fragmented rock, sand, silt, and other debris away from the continental periphery and into the deep waters of the ocean."
Have seen this landslide debris-rock identified in NW publications as 'turbidite'. Underwater slides also preserve fossil material, most famously the Burgess shale of the Canadian Rockies. Thanks for the info, Bill!
Bob
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retiredoldfogee
retiredoldfogee
47. RE: Botryoidals
Oct 3 2009, 11:52 AM EDT | Post edited: Oct 3 2009, 11:52 AM EDT
"I have been reading about the Pacific Northwest Jade since Zeke got me started on the subject of nephrite formation. Thanks Zeke, "
I still feel shamed when I think of what I sent you. I've had the flat post boxes here for some time, and planned to send you a bunch of Jade and grossular to make up for that box, yet everytime I think about it I'm like damn I still haven't verified the Jade, and frankly I have a ton of serpentine that mimics Jade perfectly in translucense, color. Except its not Jade its serpentine, and then there is the dirty hydrogrossular, and grossular that looks like muddy water. There is the botryodial jade looking stuff from Pilchuck creek, thatsome contains jade, and some looks like grey nasty schist. Or the beautiful large gemmy white coated serpentine, asbestos, and rare occasional jade from Pilchuck that looks like bone and looks like green sugar candy in the center. Then there is the turquoise Jade from my claim that I still have not technically verified if it is Jade, although most people who, have seen it think its Jade, or is it turquoise, or listwanite? Then there are the lawsonite crystals, seemingly mixed in the same stones with quartz veins or is it lawsonite veins? I'm planning on paying for a microprobe on the materials now, and ready for it, but that will only cover a thin clice of a 1mm square section which means I will need to literally slice sections from all the veins in the stones and get many analysis. Sigh. The expectations of sending a box of goodies to a mining engineer. I don't want to disapoint:( and I want to do it right. I hope the microprobe not only identifies the materials I have at the claim, and also allows me to know what I send so as not to make a behind out of myself next time.

Thanks,

Aaron
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aubreyreynolds9@gmai
aubreyreynolds9@gmai
48. RE: Botryoidals
Oct 3 2009, 2:51 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 3 2009, 2:51 PM EDT
Aaron it was some of best material I have received from Washington. I have thoroughly enjoyed it. I was wanting to look back based upon this discussion and get a more enlighten look at it. I was wanting to look to see if there is any of that green graywache. I hope you enjoyed the box I sent you. I still owe Tim and Sharon a tourmaline crystal in pink feldspar but like a dope I have it ready but lost their address.
Bill
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gamaliel114
gamaliel114
49. RE: Botryoidals
Oct 4 2009, 1:37 AM EDT | Post edited: Oct 4 2009, 1:37 AM EDT
I'm going to be spending the better part of next week on Grandy Creek with my new camera. i'll pick up some suspect greywacke and mail it to you. I'll throw in some HGG too and whatever else that i can bear to part with. I think I'll go get some slabs cut of the good Deer Creek jade (not the hgg). The way you describe the greywacke formation really describes well the stuff on Grandy Creek. But there is supose to be chert there as well...and jade can also look similar. Who knows what I'll end up sending.

~Zeke
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aubreyreynolds9@gmai
aubreyreynolds9@gmai
50. RE: Botryoidals
Oct 4 2009, 8:23 AM EDT | Post edited: Oct 4 2009, 9:12 AM EDT
"I'm going to be spending the better part of next week on Grandy Creek with my new camera. i'll pick up some suspect greywacke and mail it to you. I'll throw in some HGG too and whatever else that i can bear to part with. I think I'll go get some slabs cut of the good Deer Creek jade (not the hgg). The way you describe the greywacke formation really describes well the stuff on Grandy Creek. But there is supose to be chert there as well...and jade can also look similar. Who knows what I'll end up sending.

~Zeke"
I believe I have some graywacke Aaron sent me. I have not had a change to go look at it again. I have been helping Billie get ready for a show. Some of the green "Grossular Garnet" may be graywacke. The chert will be appear to be silky and free of grains. The Graywacke though glassy may still have some grainy texture more like quartzite. The uplifting, eroding mountains shed sediments. These sediments accumulate in basins within or on the margins of the orogrny zone, and provide a record of the orogeny. Where the orogenic belt is primarily a volcanic arc, the sediments will be rich in eroded volcanic rock debris, and clay, which some volcanic rocks quickly become as they are exposed to air and water. Sandstones rich in eroded bits of volcanic rocks and clay are called graywackes. Graywackes are "dirty sandstones," the dirty appearance coming from the dark bits of weathered volcanic rock and the clay. USGS Graywacke is a metamorphic sandstone in which grains or fragments of various minerals, as quartz and feldspar, or of rocks, as slate and siliceous clay rocks, are embedded in which (as Bob pointed out) is siliceous in much of Washington State.
Bill
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retiredoldfogee
retiredoldfogee
51. RE: Botryoidals
Oct 4 2009, 12:23 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 4 2009, 12:23 PM EDT
"I believe I have some graywacke Aaron sent me. I have not had a change to go look at it again. I have been helping Billie get ready for a show. Some of the green "Grossular Garnet" may be graywacke. The chert will be appear to be silky and free of grains. The Graywacke though glassy may still have some grainy texture more like quartzite. The uplifting, eroding mountains shed sediments. These sediments accumulate in basins within or on the margins of the orogrny zone, and provide a record of the orogeny. Where the orogenic belt is primarily a volcanic arc, the sediments will be rich in eroded volcanic rock debris, and clay, which some volcanic rocks quickly become as they are exposed to air and water. Sandstones rich in eroded bits of volcanic rocks and clay are called graywackes. Graywackes are "dirty sandstones," the dirty appearance coming from the dark bits of weathered volcanic rock and the clay. USGS Graywacke is a metamorphic sandstone in which grains or fragments of various minerals, as quartz and feldspar, or of rocks, as slate and siliceous clay rocks, are embedded in which (as Bob pointed out) is siliceous in much of Washington State.
Bill"
Hmmm, one way we tell if something is grossular garnet is by the weight usually between 3.6 to 4.6 SG. Can Graywacke have an SG that high?

Thanks,

Aaron
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gamaliel114
gamaliel114
52. RE: Botryoidals
Oct 4 2009, 1:32 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 4 2009, 1:32 PM EDT
The grossular (as found on Deer creek) is rather distinct. I don't think you cound confuse it with greywacke. the same exact stuff is found in Happy Camp California and has been tested. Sometimes there is Vesuvianite on those pieces as well (a more olive green color). Here are some examples of the HGG:
http://s621.photobucket.com/albums/tt297/gamaliel114/DeerCreek/DeerCreek071209/HelloRock/?albumview=slideshow

http://s621.photobucket.com/albums/tt297/gamaliel114/DeerCreek/DeerCreek071209/Nice/?albumview=slideshow

http://s621.photobucket.com/albums/tt297/gamaliel114/DeerCreek/DEERCREEK070309/2Sided/?albumview=slideshow

There are also opaque varieties. the last slideshow shows a piece with both the translucent and opaque varieties. later today i'll post a picture of the white translucent stuff (like the first slide show) attached to a mass of soft black serpentine (?). As far as i can tell most of the HGG around here doesn't look like the Transvaal jade (HGG) from other localities, which could be mistaken for cherts and greywacke...maybe.

~Zeke
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gamaliel114
gamaliel114
53. RE: Botryoidals
Oct 4 2009, 9:51 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 4 2009, 9:51 PM EDT
Alright, another slide show you will have to cut and paste. This is the hydrogrossular garnet on black serpentine from Deer Creek. The HGG is like Aaron described, like dirty water. There is nice green in it too. I would call this rock a blackwall rodingite. I think it will make a great suiseki piece as it looks like mountains...the Cascades maybe? I love this one even though it doesn't have quality material on it. the HGG is however the same as "HelloRock" above. if you can't tell, the HGG is the mountain peaks on top of the bulk which is some sort of serpentine material (very soft).

http://s790.photobucket.com/albums/yy184/jadadara/DEERCREEK/Summer09/Cascades/?albumview=slideshow

~Zeke
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gamaliel114
gamaliel114
54. RE: Botryoidals
Oct 16 2009, 12:05 AM EDT | Post edited: Oct 16 2009, 12:05 AM EDT
Alright, because of the drama in my family these last two weeks, I didn't get a chance to hit Grandy yet. But as I was smoking a cigarette outside at my brother's house I realized there was a pile of the Grandy creek chert/greywacke/whatever right there. i could have taken better shots...the sun's glare didn't help...but here is a slideshow of the material;

http://s790.photobucket.com/albums/yy184/jadadara/GRANDYCREEK/GreyChertWallRocks/?albumview=slideshow

~Zeke
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aubreyreynolds9@gmai
aubreyreynolds9@gmai
55. RE: Botryoidals
Oct 16 2009, 8:12 AM EDT | Post edited: Oct 16 2009, 8:12 AM EDT
Definitely not chert. Back east it seems the world is made of limestone and chert with igneous intrusions that occur occasionally to metaphorically change the sedimentary layers. Not the radical diverse geology of the West coast. The picture I saw looked like greywacke conglomerate. There are obvious chunks of broken rock cemented into the matrix. I agree with Bob the the greywacke is mostly silica. See my post above on Oct 3' Thanks for sharing.
Bill
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gamaliel114
gamaliel114
56. RE: Botryoidals
Oct 16 2009, 2:55 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 16 2009, 2:55 PM EDT
Thanks Bill. There is chert on the creek too, but I think the chert that is there is grey, not greenish blueish grey like this stuff...though some of the solid bluegreen stuff is likely chert too (it shows layering with no obvious chunks) but we didn't have too many good pieces at the house to take a picture of. I glad i finally know what that stuff is, it had been driving me crazy for nearly a year trying to pin it down.

~Zeke
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gamaliel114
gamaliel114
57. RE: Botryoidals
Oct 16 2009, 3:23 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 16 2009, 3:23 PM EDT
I have decided that all you geologists are crazy. Why can't you call things one thing instead each having thier own pet way of describing the same rocks? I think i found where on grandy the "greywacke" is, but that term is not used at all. instead they seem to describe all the constiteunt parts of the greywacke...is that a correct assumption? At any rate, i figured out the metasomatic zone there that should have the Bots...not even that far up the creek. Can't wait to go.

~zeke
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gamaliel114
gamaliel114
58. RE: Botryoidals
Oct 16 2009, 4:42 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 16 2009, 4:42 PM EDT
a little bit of research goes a long way. next year i'm going to have to hit the South and middle forks of the nooksack...both have jade from the same general source as grandy....grandy's is just the tail end. I seem to recall a mine up there as well...can't recall where i got that info though.

~Zeke
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aubreyreynolds9@gmai
aubreyreynolds9@gmai
59. RE: Botryoidals
Oct 17 2009, 1:47 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 17 2009, 1:47 PM EDT
"a little bit of research goes a long way. next year i'm going to have to hit the South and middle forks of the nooksack...both have jade from the same general source as grandy....grandy's is just the tail end. I seem to recall a mine up there as well...can't recall where i got that info though.

~Zeke"
Zeke you are becoming a true Rockhound. Learn all you can about your passion. Apply that knowledge and sniff it out. There is no fun in Rockhounding like finding a new site with great specimens. Tom always said, "Study mother earth, respect her and she will open her treasures to you."
Bill
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